43 thoughts on “On falling Mac sales and the lack of refreshes”

1. I am very hopeful that this situation is reversed this fall. I am in the market for a new desktop and I really don’t want to go the Hackintosh route. I think at that point Windows 10 might be more viable for me. At least for my 3d work.

2. The sad fact is that computers are about as fast and powerful as they need to be for the vast majority of the consumer public.

   They could bump the processor speed and video cards. They could bump storage and RAM. But for 99% of the computer buying public, those things simply aren’t necessary.

   Apple isn’t trying to make the tiny niche market of pro video editors and high-end graphics pros happy anymore. Even if Apple put in blockbuster specs into the MacPro today, the bulk of even the small pro market don’t update nearly as often.

   So what is Apple (and really, any other hardware maker) to do?

3. Do doubt Cook is stacking his resources towards the products that are moving off the shelf the fastest.

   Most non-professionals get by with an iPhone or iPad. Most professionals have a work laptop they are given. Students get free Chrome Books.

   The demand for high-end laptops and desktops is, most likely, dwindling, which sucks for us who love them and prefer to use them.

   I finally broke down and had to buy a MBP last March because I couldn’t wait any longer for the rumored new MBP. It’s not much of an improvement over it’s replacement, MBP Early 2013, a 3 year old machine.

   I would gladly welcome Apple making MBPs using their own chips, so long as they are superior to Intel chips.

4. There is a lot of little things causing this new product delay, but first and foremost is Intel. Their CPU, and integrated GPU, have not delivered in time (delays) and performance.

   At the same time, Apple could certainly afford to update the Mac Pro, even if only graphics and storage systems.

   For the MacBook Pro lineup, they are certainly preparing a new format/chassis after a long spell for the current model. The MacBook Air is being phased out (price drops instead of spec bumps).

   Perfect storm! Still, there’s light at the end of the tunnel.

5. I believe Intel fell behind on their deliveries and performance promises to Apple, so Apple may be doing something to break free of being tethered to them. Perhaps Apple is accelerating plans to put one of their own chip designs in laptops? Maybe a multicore ARM design with fast emulation of the x86 instruction set?

6. nonsense. all PCs already are “trucks”, thats the whole point of Jobs’ analogy. “cars” are iOS devices. and for many people theyve replaced typical laptop use cases. if all you need is something to check email, general word procesing & spreadsheets (including Word & Excel), and draw on, then the iPad has you covered.

7. i dont know whats wrong w/ me, but im a pro developer and even i dont replace my laptop every 3 years. my fully-loaded iMac is 2011 and since its SSD and 20gb ram and 2GB vram, its still plenty fast for me — virtual machines, compiling apps, occasional renders, and even some gaming. my rMBP is 2014 and screams for these same tasks.

8. Exactly this. I suspect the reason the Mac Pro has gone so long is that Apple wanted to put both Broadwell and Thunderbolt 3 inside (though AMD’s delays on GPUs haven’t helped).

   And the 15″ MacBook Pro, well, those CPU’s didn’t launch in a Broadwell variant (it was a ‘paper launch’) so they’ve had to wait for Skylake supplies to be good enough.

9. Too early for that, especially on the high end. You’ll see a lower end machine like the Mini or Retina MacBook go ARM before you see the “pro” class machines.

10. that’s what I would expect as well but perhaps they are rolling one in like a coprocessor. Still an Intel processor in there, but an Apple GPU/CPU co-processor with excellent full time GPU performance and decent CPU performance in low power situations.

11. that’s what I would expect as well but perhaps they are rolling one in like a coprocessor. Still an Intel processor in there, but an Apple GPU/CPU co-processor with excellent full time GPU performance and decent CPU performance in low power situations.

12. Your expectations may be right. An Apple SOC as co-processor for low power mode makes a lot of sense in a dual boot device (macOS + iOS).
    I still bet that Apple wants to develop iOS as a tablet OS and add power user functions/software an in 2 years release an iOS “laptop” (2-in-1 with detachable keyboard)

13. This. My development system is a 2010 iMac Quad i7. About the only thing I really miss is USB3, and that’s not enough to justify the cost of a new one. My laptop is a 2013 MBA which is perfect for my needs.

14. I wonder if the more senior, more influential people in Apple opt for iOS and other non-Mac projects, leaving the Mac with less management and design influence.

    even if that’s true, Apple needs to get some better rhythm to Mac releases. Yes, they’re at the mercy of Intel… but that doesn’t explain the lack of a new Macbook Pro nor the lack of a Pro update.

15. Not really and if Apple thinks that, they’re wrong. A laptop is still FAR better for typical office uses (text, spreadsheets, etc). Those cases are were precision poignant devices and dedicated keyboards shine. Add in the myriad other things you can do on a laptop that aren’t necessarily about power but about the form factor, interaction tools and the OS and regular computers walk all over an iPad and they

16. Then why ship the Pro at all? If they want to cede the professional market to Windows, fine. But don’t ship thing, then neglect them. And none of what you say is really valid for the Macbook Pro.

17. That’s BS. It’s almost as if you never get out of the house. I’m an IT professional and use an iPadPro exclusively. If I can do it then most non-IT pros can. Just because you can’t figure out how to do your work on an iPad doesn’t mean people smarter than you can’t.

18. Apple is dedicating resource to future R&D (think cars, VR, etc). It’s not like they’re sitting on their asses doing nothing. Give me the next iPhone breakthrough over an updated Mac any day.

19. Many parts to this. Intel has had numerous delays of their microprocessors. I believe the next Macbook Pro is going to be a significant redesign. The Mac Pro likely has one or two more generations and then I see Apple putting it to bed.

    I know a lot of people think Apple is stagnant but in reality the computing market has matured and we’re just seeing incremental improvements in interface speeds, GPU speeds and microprocessor.

    I kind of feel for today’s generations of computing fans. They don’t realize it but they’re living in the most boring time ever. I grew up in the computing wild wild west where you had so many fantastic platform. Remember when Apple was working with Exponential or excitement about the next IBM PPC chip (that never came beyond the G5). Remember Elbrus, SGI and Cray?

    Well the big boys won and we’ve got pretty boring computing landscape to show for it. I don’t know why anyone is surprised.

20. LOL. That analogy has always sucked. If PC are trucks then iOS devices are skateboards. Cars typically can do most of what trucks can do. Moving from Mac to iOS is a lesson in what features you have to give up.

    Consumers are realizing this which is why if you contrast the first two years of iPad sales with the last two you’ll see an obvious trend that isn’t positive.

21. Maybe they are getting ready to introduce a touch screen MacBook Pro? If they can bring out a pencil for the iPad then there are no sacred buffaloes.

22. First, F off with the insults. Second, people CAN do a lot of things on an iPad. But if you want to edit text a lot or do anything where you need precision selection of text, cells, etc. it’s FAR easier on a laptop that an iPad simply because it’s designed for pixel level pointing. Does this change with the pencil? Maybe…

    PS: As I checked to see if there were any intelligent comments (no), I’m taking a break from writing a long report. On my Air. After this I’ll be writing a bit of code to grab and parse some JSON from an service’s API so I can shove it into a database and work then merge it with a bunch of data from elsewhere. COULD I do all of this on an iPad? Maybe. But why would I when I have excellent tools on OS X that will help me do all of that very efficiently? To be hipster and cool and say I do it on an iPad? Screw that – I’m about getting things done, not trying to be one of the cool kids.

23. I’m on the fence. I really want a new retina machine, but the 2013 Air (i7, 256g SSD, 8g RAM) does everything I need just fine. Occasionally when doing big compute intensive tasks it will slow down but those are like 2% of my work.

24. I also wonder why Apple is so quiet about this issue. Nobody in the know is unaware that the current models are outdated. They are simply going to either wait if they can, or buy if they absolutely have to. Why not leak some information about new refreshes coming in the fall, only if that’s the only information they let out? Would that really hurt sales? I guess we’ll figure out more in the Q3 report with Q4 guidance, but that seems to be a sucky way to figure out.

25. I used my 2009 Mac Mini until last year when I finally bumped up to the current Mac Mini. Probably could have upgraded the older Mac Mini, but I wanted to pass that on to a family member and get a new shiny. Otherwise, like all of you, I would be building my websites on an older system, too.

26. Typically, I can get a good 6 years out of my Mac/MacBook. My 2013 model was having tech major issues and was just outside of its AppleCare, so I had to replace it when it finally died.

27. nonsense. Computers – traditional computational devices are great for things still and even better when you can prolong the life of your investment. Apple used to know this, but now all they make are gadgets … even the computers are much more difficult to grade these days … at least Apple keeps the touchOS separate from the traditionalOS (UI wise).

28. Hmmmm, If only we could get some INTEL on what is causing the delays…

29. I’ve actually dared tech writers to mention the lack of mouse/trackpad support.

30. I’ve been an exclusive Mac user between 1986 – 2015.

    When I looked at PC hardware/software it was like watching corpses being chainsawed out of car wrecks. No, seriously. Hasbro boxes and OS. I didn’t care if it was what most people used or that games lived there.

    The hardware and software was wretched.

    My wifey needed a PC for work. ARRGGHHH. I nabbed a nice Asus Zenbook (Mac-ish in all ways but price) and upgraded to 8.1. The hardware was basically fine. The OS seemed promising until I realized it was appallingly unintuitive.

    Want to go LEFT? Click DOWN. Want to start THIS? Start THAT instead! It was like waterboarding. Amazon accepted a return solely on the grounds that the OS was unusable. And I mean that. I’d rather use Linux Mint or Ubuntu Mate. Windows 8.1? Ruuuubbish.

    Wifey’s need for a PC got postponed. Lucky me because I refused to support it. Then Windows 10 came out just as the delay ended. Got her a different Asus (15 inch) and — miracles of miracles —

    — Win10 is acceptable. Basically pleasant once you get used to things. Better than any Windows or Linux. That WOW feeling going from OS 9 to OS X. Leapfrog.

    As a Mac user you’ll dislike the Mail app. It’s okay but it’s no OS X Mail. I never use brand browsers and so Firefox is Firefox in 10. So is iTunes to a degree. Get yourself LibreOffice for free if you don’t live in Office.

    Windows Defender works fine and in almost a year with two PCs I haven’t had one virus. And I’m not web shy. I didn’t feel like paying for Malware Bytes and so you can get their free version and manually check. Nothing found there either.

    It’s not as good as OS X but so what for your needs? The support is a good news bad news thing. It’s way cheaper but you get half as much support. So you kinda have to become your own IT guy for a few months until you GET your PC and then you’re fine.

    One piece of advise: Apple gives you a year to consider extending warranty. PCs seem to be 30 days after purchase. (Wish it was 90.) So, like me, if you try Win10 and feel it was a bad move, you can still eBay within the year and pay no extended warranty. Or get a ‘new’ one via a new PC.

    I’m holding out for a new iMac or Mac Mini this fall. A Mac will ALWAYS be my base computer. But if Win10 improves and improves… even that might change.

    Check out the Asus AllinOnes. Monster spec, cheaper prices. They may be all you need.

31. Much as I like the small laptops, the erogonomics for long-term use are already terrible at that size and layout. iPad + dangling keyboard for any length of time? Extremely damaging to the body and eyesight.

32. I just got a new iMac to replace my 2010 Mac Pro, not because there was an exciting new release, but because it was time to replace a machine that could no longer run two screens without sounding like a jet engine.

    I envy anyone who can get their work done on one smaller screen, whether that’s a MacBook or an iPad. That’s not for me.

33. Professionally (scientist/professor) and at home, the main reason not to upgrade/expand on Macs is the lack of storage options (nothing higher than 3TB when 6/8/10TB drives are available), no more RAM upgrade (soldered on Mac mini and iMac 20″!), no ability to upgrade storage after purchase, no 17″ laptop, no matte display, no server hardware (cannot add second drive to mac mini anymore). I was used to buy 3-4 macs per year, only bought 1 MacBookPro in 2015, waiting for Apple to give pro users some love…..

34. I am going to wait until this fall and see what happens.

35. I’m waiting too. (Replace iMac before warranty runs out?) Yet in the Cook age of Apple I find waiting always results in extremely minor changes with a small price increase. Which isn’t wise with Win10 in the wild.

36. The advantage of the Air for me is that it’s very portable, lets me take my work anywhere, has tools I can’t get on the iPad and yet can be connected to my two 24″ monitors and a keyboard and mouse when I’m at my desk and need/want that real-estate. The downsides in relation to the iPad are mostly the lack of retina display and the lack of touch. For what I do, these aren’t killer losses. For other, the iPad will be a better fit, but not, I think for most people wanting to do traditional computing tasks.

    really, the iPad and touch devices in general are best at point to a world where we aren’t using the traditional office stuff. After all, MSFT Office and its descendants mimic 20th century work. 21st century work is more likely to be different than it is to be the same. Think Tony Stark’s lab more than a 1950s corporation.

37. It’s my great hope that Apple will one day make computers that can be upgraded again. You remember the good old days when RAM could be added, hard drives swapped, a PCI board inserted that brought new functionality aboard. I understand why Apple likes closed boxes, and it’s a good thing for many consumers. But there are a great number of people who enjoy tinkering with their Mac, and extending its lifetime and utility. Were Apple to truly care for the environment, it would offer this to the public. I personally know quite a few people, myself included, that would buy a new Mac but Apple does not make a model that interests them. Most likely a Hackintosh is in our future. Such is life.

    In my vision of Apple, it would make both closed and open products. The open products would be the pro lines — MacBook Pro, Mac Pro, and iPhone Pro. These products would offer additional features such as expandability and easy repairability. You know, the kinds of things that Apple is loathe to give its customers today.

38. They stopped doing that because, IIRC, they found that under 5% of the people who bought machines ever upgraded them, at all. There are real advantages in weight, space and efficiency if you can just solder the components to the main board and if doing that only inconveniences 1 in 20 people but it mean the other 19 can get a smaller, lighter machine… doing away with upgradability is probably the right move.

    What I do is this – instead of spending the money on RAM or a drive to upgrade the current machine I watch the price of what I’m using starting at about the 3 year mark and I sell my current Mac and buy a new one. Crazy? No. I sold a 2011 Air whose SSD was a bit too small for me and bought a new 2013 Air. Incremental price? About $450 which gave me a better CPU, marginally better graphics (about 60% upgrade) and double the drive space. At the time a 256G SSD was about $200. So, let’s assume the rest of the upgrade wasn’t worth it… every year I spend $250 or so over and above what upgrading my machine would cost me. $80 a year ‘wasted’. Eh.

39. In the “Cook age of Apple”? The original iMac wasn’t changed at all for 4 years (1998-2002) and was still a G3 processor all that time – they just added fancier colors. The Powerbook G4 from 2001-2006? This has nothing to do with Tim Cook. Apple doesn’t come out with something new every year just for the heck of it, and they never have done that.

40. As they say, “Not entirely accurate.”

    Besides color changes, the iMac picked up a DVD player (Remember the iMac DV?), and a CD burner. It was redesigned to allow the user to upgrade the memory without taking it apart. CPU speeds were bumped during those 6 years from 233 MHz up to 700 MHz.

    One reason that Apple has been slow to upgrade machine, IMHO, is that they’re pushing the envelope on thinness and thermal design. To put it simply, the design of a MacBook Pro can handle these CPUs and no others. Increase the heat of the CPU by 10% and it won’t work.

    This means that Apple can’t really just offer a “speed bump” every six months like they used to just by swapping out one chip for another. There’s no tolerance left for even a slightly hotter CPU. “Upgrading” the old computer is now a major undertaking rather than just sourcing some new parts. And major undertakings cost money.

41. I never said once a year. I said, “In the Cook age of Apple I find waiting always results in extremely minor changes with a small price increase.”

    Case in point the Apple TV. Took forever and came with a price increase.

    Mac Mini. When the update finally arrived it was a spec and feature decrease. A form of a price increase.

    MacBook Air took FOREVER to offer 8GBs standard and the screen STILL isn’t 1080p. (I think this price remained the same, but a modern version of the Air — the Core M — $1229.)

    SSD is a special honor at Apple for the lucky and few. It’s no big whoop at Asus and half the price.

    I don’t like the Cook era of Apple in the slightest and I’m not going to apologize about it.

42. In the camera market (DSLR and mirrorless), Thom Hogan has written of “last camera syndrome”: the concern by the camera manufacturers that the next generation of cameras may be the last ones their customer base ever needs to buy, leading to the collapse of the industry into a low-volume replacement market. I have to wonder if Apple is having the same thoughts about PCs, laptops in particular.

43. It does, actually, explain it for the exact reason you stated. The Skylake chips for MBP just came out, and the dGPUs likely slated for the 15″ are shipping next month (Polaris). I’m not tracking the Xeon releases for the Pro but I assume it’s a combo of that and next gen GPU releases.