I’ve been asked about ad tracking on The Loop quite a bit since iOS 9 and its content blockers were released. I use The Deck to serve ads on the site, and have for the last few years. Jim Coudal, the owner of The Deck, and I share a philosophy that ads should be unobtrusive and respectful to the reader.
Here is The Deck’s official stance on ad tracking (spoiler: there is none):
Short version. We don’t track our readers in any way or allow any other behind-the-scenes shenanigans. We just serve useful, relevant ads in a simple, unobtrusive way to support independent publishers. Please white-list The Deck when using ad blocking software. Thanks.
We will never share your personal information obtained by tracking, either individually or in aggregate, with advertisers or any one else for one very good reason: we don’t have any.
I understand people are upset with being tracked and having ads all over the sites they want to visit, but that’s not what The Deck or The Loop is about. When you block the sites that do make you angry, remember to white-list the ones that treat you with respect.
Coudal also recently spoke with Fast Company about ad blocking.
Sites like The Loop, SixColors, and Daring Fireball were immediately white-listed. There are a few Apple sites I frequent, however, that could really stand to improve on their ads and I’ll continue to block them and periodically check the experience with the blocker on pause.
You’ve been white-listed.
Almost all advertising is unethical- including that from The Deck.
Totally white listed
How is it unethical?
The deck’s ads are based on the content provider’s idea of what their audience is, rather than a spy network’s idea of what you want based on surveillance of your browsing history.
The former is the standard model for ethical advertising, the latter is the drain circling race to your bottom that is repulsive.
Jim,
I’m confused.
If being tracked is not what the Loop is all about how do you explain the trackers from Cloudfront, exelator, disqus, chartbeat and quantserve? Wouldn’t the Google tracker suffice?
And yes, I do whitelist you.
Because it is manipulating the cognitive process behind the decision making to buy/support/whatever a product/service/whatever. Therefore, any advertising is unethical unless the person that it is presented for has asked for it (and a blanket “I accept ads” doesn’t work because the person needs to be aware of it in that specific moment.
Basically, the same reason it’s unethical to design a society to promote food deserts, car dependence etc.
And yes, I do know that it sounds pretty far out there for most people, but that doesn’t bother me. It’s just a temporary societal glitch anyway. 🙂
“When you block the sites that do make you angry, remember to white-list the ones that treat you with respect.”
This is really important – I whitelist the sites I find valuable EVEN IF they have ads that I dislike. I might fine-tune things to allow some ads on them and not others, but for now I feel that if I’m visiting a site (like this one) regularly, I need to allow at least some ads to compensate for the value I’m getting. On the desktop, Ghostery allows you to whitelist networks and the Deck is whitelisted so that if I visit a link to a Deck supported site they get a bit of cash.
HOWEVER… that only works because of knowing about The Deck. we need some way to know about other ad networks and likely what we need is for that way to be machine readable and accurate. If ad networks said ‘I do these things’ we could configure blockers to allow certain behaviors and not others. But networks would cheat, etc so…
Oh bullshit. Ads serve to make you aware of a product. Yes, some try to manipulate you but that doesn’t mean all do. And if you feel that way, do the ethical thing and stop reading the content that other people support.
Disqus is this commenting system. Cloud front (which I don’t see in Ghostery here) is a CDN (Amazon’s actually).
The other analytics are something I’d like Jim’s take on too. It’s valuable to know how people behave on your site because it does tell you what topics they read (and thus perhaps what you might want to write more of), etc. But I’ve never really understood the propensity of site owners to have multiple analytics packages. Unless you take some serious time to analyze that data, it’s just cruft.
No. Just no.
Advertising is at base and at its best when it’s curated by a trusted friend. That’s what word of mouth is all about.
So the deck delivers advertising via the conscious inclusion by the site owner. Someone whose recommendations I trust.
Opposed to the narcissistic regurgitation of merz based on a spy network’s algorithmically generated avatar of me.
The first is ok, the second is deeply creepy.
What bullshit? Yes, ads serve to make you aware of products. Have I said otherwise? That’s why Coca Cola and McDonalds spend such ridiculous amounts on advertising.
And guess what? It works. Why does it work? Because it bypasses our rational decision making and instead abuses heuristics – i.e. people are much more likely to chose something they they recognise.
I’m not stopping anyone from blocking me for using adblockers and I don’t try to circumvent it if they do. 🙂
You’re over focused on large producers. Ads are especially valuable to smaller producers when targeted well. For example, The Deck sometimes shows ads for a newish content management system called Craft. That works because The Deck has assembled a set of publishers whose audience very well might find that a relevant ad. Craft gets exposure to a set of people who might like to know about their product and, unlike Coke etc, they’re not going to become known easily aside from ads.
“I’m not stopping anyone from blocking me for using adblockers and I don’t try to circumvent it if they do.”
So instead of backing up your words with your actions you’ll continue to read content that you refuse to support unless someone stops you. So much for your strong ethics.
I will whitelist sites that have curated their advertising – ensuring it is useful to their readers. I ad block sites that accept an uncontrolled hose pipe full of shite to spray at their readers because a spy network paid them to.
I also don’t like the term “whitelist”. Fuck that.
I’m sure some people will find it relevant. However, I’m much more sure that it does not in any way contribute to better decision making. The only reason it is necessary at all is because of advertising in the first place, because otherwise the natural inclination would be to find information in other, better and more informative ways.
I don’t refuse to support The Loop. They’ve never shown me a user agreement where I agree to look at their ads. I’m backing up my words by following my ideals and not do things I have agreed to not do, as everyone should.
And hey, please try to keep a nice tone!
Maybe it’s as simple as the ad networks putting up a menu of ads the content creator can choose from, rather than relying on creepy algorithms trying sell me things I’ve already bought.
Then you’d know the content creator was curating ads they thought you’d be interested in.
So, for example, loop advertises CSS resources, intranet alternatives, amplifier modelling apps and beard oil.
No, advertising is at its best when the user is actively aware that they are looking at advertising that is trying to affect them.
And your point is that people looking at deck ads aren’t actively aware that they are looking at an ad, in that ad space, just there, called an ad?
Bum gravy.
You make good points for discussion. But the answer is still no.
Absolutely. It’s not that they are unable to identify it as advertising if asked, it’s that it is something that they’ll see but not actively process. If you don’t think it happens to you, there’s a lot of research out there pointing out just how unlikely that is.
Good point. I’m almost convinced. I’ll have a think about that. Thanks for the counter view.
The Loop also uses DoubleClick which, unlike The Deck, is among the worst when it comes to tracking. You may want to rethink the automatic whitelisting and simply enable “The Deck” and “Disqus”.
” i.e. people are much more likely to chose something they they recognise.”
only if you are (as Jabba puts it) a weak minded fool.
your advertising mind tricks do not work on me.
” I’m much more sure that it does not in any way contribute to better decision making. “
…of course it does. it offers a choice. I’m looking for XX. I didn’t know YY company even made XX. I really like the other stuff I got from YY company. I can make a better decision about which XX to buy.
“find information in other, better and more informative ways.”
…do you NOT do this for EVERY SINGLE (important) purchase you make regardless of how you heard about the product.
again.. an ad.. just gives me more options to get more information in better and more informative ways.
if you act strictly on an ad.. you’re just dumb.. and frankly probably spend more time reading TMZ and 4chan than The Loop,
While I’m not fond of tracking, it’s the more egregious – obnoxious ads all over a page, yanking me to the App Store, or slowing page loads considerably.
Word
I don’t doubt that you believe that. I do, however, doubt that it is true, you just don’t know it, just like people don’t know that they’re more likely to chose a product that is to their right – even if it’s identical to the one to their left, and then can rationalise fantastically complex reasons for doing so.
There’s so much research showing that not being affected by advertising is almost impossible, so if you think only “week minded fools” are affected by it…that’s pretty much the entire human race.
Why the disdain for Analytics? Site operators need some tools to measure how many people visit their site, how they arrive there, and what they like while visiting. How else to gauge what works and what doesn’t?
What do you use on your site for these purposes?
I’ve come round to your opinion. Well argued and salient